Discussion:
texlive on Raspberry Pi
(too old to reply)
Simon Dales
2018-04-08 15:21:35 UTC
Permalink
Karl + Norbert et al,

Raspberry Pi-s have a non-standard configuration that makes installation
a bit less simple than on your regular PC or Mac.

/////////////
/// BTW
Principally caused by using SD cards for main storage and having /tmp
mounted in a smallish tmpfs. And no DVD drives or HDD. This feature can
make install harder and risks failing altogether.

When you know these specifics we hope it installs easily.

Once installed; TeX works lovely.

/////////////

Now have added a good working page to UKTUG's www. Probably basically
stable but will almost certainly get a few tweaks over the next few
weeks.

Please will you include the link in relevant places in your
documentation. Note cutoff is tomorrow (Monday).

http://uk.tug.org/texlive/texlive-on-raspberry-pi/

///////////////

Simon
Zdenek Wagner
2018-04-08 16:00:51 UTC
Permalink
Hi,

what kind of nonstandard configuration dou you have? I have not tried TL
2018 so far but in the previous years I did not need anything special.

Zdeněk Wagner
http://ttsm.icpf.cas.cz/team/wagner.shtml
http://icebearsoft.euweb.cz
Post by Simon Dales
Karl + Norbert et al,
Raspberry Pi-s have a non-standard configuration that makes installation
a bit less simple than on your regular PC or Mac.
/////////////
/// BTW
Principally caused by using SD cards for main storage and having /tmp
mounted in a smallish tmpfs. And no DVD drives or HDD. This feature can
make install harder and risks failing altogether.
When you know these specifics we hope it installs easily.
Once installed; TeX works lovely.
/////////////
Now have added a good working page to UKTUG's www. Probably basically
stable but will almost certainly get a few tweaks over the next few
weeks.
Please will you include the link in relevant places in your
documentation. Note cutoff is tomorrow (Monday).
http://uk.tug.org/texlive/texlive-on-raspberry-pi/
///////////////
Simon
Johannes Hielscher
2018-04-08 19:47:09 UTC
Permalink
Am Sun, 08 Apr 2018 16:21:35 +0100
Post by Simon Dales
Raspberry Pi-s have a non-standard configuration that makes
installation a bit less simple than on your regular PC or Mac.
[…]
Post by Simon Dales
http://uk.tug.org/texlive/texlive-on-raspberry-pi/
OK, same question as Zdeněk here. But the link makes clear that it
isn't the TL installer that would not work out of the box (it does
indeed), but you have collected some tweaks to make TeX life easier on
RPi'ish hardware.

Addressing the patience with the bad I/O performance of mmcblk and
the flash modules themselves:
I would not hesitate to recommend just to take out the µSD, put it into
an ordinary PC, and ./install-tl the armhf-linux binary distribution
along with the native one there (you can delete it from within your RPi
if you don't need it any longer, e. g. to compare the TeX performance
of your SBC with dedicated PC hardware).
The bandwidth of carrying around mass storage devices is unmatched.
Feel free to add this pointer to your page.

Best,
Johannes
Simon Dales
2018-04-09 05:41:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by Johannes Hielscher
Am Sun, 08 Apr 2018 16:21:35 +0100
Post by Simon Dales
Raspberry Pi-s have a non-standard configuration that makes
installation a bit less simple than on your regular PC or Mac.
[…]
Post by Simon Dales
http://uk.tug.org/texlive/texlive-on-raspberry-pi/
OK, same question as Zdeněk here. But the link makes clear that it
isn't the TL installer that would not work out of the box (it does
indeed), but you have collected some tweaks to make TeX life easier on
RPi'ish hardware.
I found that if you do a full-sized install of texlive using the regular
tmpfs /tmp it failed. Using a USB HDD and setting TMPDIR to point there,
it worked.

And, if you have gone to the hassle of getting a USB HDD (permanent or
temporary), you may as well use the rest of its features.
Post by Johannes Hielscher
Addressing the patience with the bad I/O performance of mmcblk and
I would not hesitate to recommend just to take out the µSD, put it into
an ordinary PC, and ./install-tl the armhf-linux binary distribution
along with the native one there (you can delete it from within your RPi
if you don't need it any longer, e. g. to compare the TeX performance
of your SBC with dedicated PC hardware).
The bandwidth of carrying around mass storage devices is unmatched.
Feel free to add this pointer to your page.
I had thought of that solution. However on the instructions you would
need some huge caveats lest a noob inadvertently trashes their own PC's
TeX Live installation. You might not get it wrong, but plenty of people
could.

Another, hybrid, solution is to sshfs/NFS the DVD and then just have tmp
(+swapfile?) in your USB HDD.

I agree that it's slower than having the SD in your PC, but could be
easier on a noob's braincells(?). The speed's not too awful; set it
going and eventually it says "finished".

///////////////

Simon
Zdenek Wagner
2018-04-09 08:41:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by Simon Dales
Post by Johannes Hielscher
Am Sun, 08 Apr 2018 16:21:35 +0100
Post by Simon Dales
Raspberry Pi-s have a non-standard configuration that makes
installation a bit less simple than on your regular PC or Mac.
[
]
Post by Simon Dales
http://uk.tug.org/texlive/texlive-on-raspberry-pi/
OK, same question as Zdeněk here. But the link makes clear that it
isn't the TL installer that would not work out of the box (it does
indeed), but you have collected some tweaks to make TeX life easier on
RPi'ish hardware.
I found that if you do a full-sized install of texlive using the regular
tmpfs /tmp it failed. Using a USB HDD and setting TMPDIR to point there,
it worked.
Strange, I have two Rpi's with two different versions of Raspbian and none
of them uses /tmp on tmpfs (and I would never use it on a machine with
so few RAM, I do it on desktops with 32 GB RAM and limit the size of .tmp
to 1 GB).

This is my layout and notice that I have TL 2015 and 2018 installed:

***@raspberry:~ $ df -h
Filesystem Size Used Avail Use% Mounted on
/dev/root 116G 58G 54G 52% /
devtmpfs 214M 0 214M 0% /dev
tmpfs 218M 0 218M 0% /dev/shm
tmpfs 218M 25M 193M 12% /run
tmpfs 5.0M 8.0K 5.0M 1% /run/lock
tmpfs 218M 0 218M 0% /sys/fs/cgroup
/dev/mmcblk0p1 60M 20M 41M 34% /boot
tmpfs 44M 0 44M 0% /run/user/1002
tmpfs 44M 0 44M 0% /run/user/1000
***@raspberry:~ $ ll /usr/local/texlive/
total 2720
drwxrwxr-x 9 pi pi 4096 Jan 30 2016 2015
drwxr-xr-x 7 pi pi 4096 Apr 9 05:21 2018
lrwxrwxrwx 1 pi pi 4 Feb 7 2016 current -> 2015
drwxr-xr-x 4 pi pi 4096 Apr 8 02:26 install-tl-20180408
-rw-r--r-- 1 pi pi 2755976 Apr 8 19:17 install-tl-unx.tar.gz
drwxr-xr-x 8 pi pi 4096 Jan 30 2016 texmf-devel
drwxr-sr-x 15 pi pi 4096 Aug 12 2016 texmf-local
drwxr-xr-x 7 pi pi 4096 Feb 5 2012 ufalpbml
drwxr-xr-x 7 pi pi 4096 Jan 30 2016 velthuis

This is a server that controlls my home network (DHCP, DDNS, gateway
between computers
and Synology)), it is not used for TeXing.



Zdeněk Wagner
http://ttsm.icpf.cas.cz/team/wagner.shtml
http://icebearsoft.euweb.cz

...
Post by Simon Dales
///////////////
Simon
Simon Dales
2018-04-09 09:17:10 UTC
Permalink
Post by Zdenek Wagner
Strange, I have two Rpi's with two different versions of Raspbian and
none of them uses /tmp on tmpfs
Depends on the Raspbian/whatever distro. Stretch uses tmpfs, so too
Wheezy. I can't find a Jessie to interrogate at the moment, but
most-likely is tmpfs (interpolation).

Of course if your /tmp is in your root directory of your main storage
then /tmp is unlikely to have a reachable max size/inode limit.

But one too many writes on your SD and it dies. No SMART to help you
watch its advancing decrepitude; it just goes phut one day; and no OS,
no boot, nothing.
Post by Zdenek Wagner
(and I would never use it on a machine with so few RAM, I do it on
desktops with 32 GB RAM and limit the size of .tmp to 1 GB).
A RPi won't be so wizzy as a PC, especially not one with lots of RAM,
quick disk and posh graphics card.

But for ~£20 what do you expect? And sucks less 240V from the wall.

/////////////////

Simon
Markus Kohm
2018-04-09 12:13:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by Simon Dales
Stretch uses tmpfs
Not for /tmp:

$ cat /etc/os-release | grep PRETTY_NAME
PRETTY_NAME="Raspbian GNU/Linux 9 (stretch)"
$ mount | grep /tmp
$

/tmp is even not a mountpoint but a directory of /.

Markus
Simon Dales
2018-04-09 12:55:27 UTC
Permalink
Markus,
Post by Markus Kohm
Post by Simon Dales
Stretch uses tmpfs
$ cat /etc/os-release | grep PRETTY_NAME
PRETTY_NAME="Raspbian GNU/Linux 9 (stretch)"
$ mount | grep /tmp
$
/tmp is even not a mountpoint but a directory of /.
It is in any Raspbian that I have examined (Wheezy + Stretch). I did
nothing special; it just installed that way out of the box.

Makes sense to have /tmp tmpfs: preserves your SD. Depends on your mean
daily writes. Lots of people will be lucky. Some of my systems are quite
active, and I have killed flash that way. It's got no SMART so it
suddenly dies: instant Norwegian Blue.

Not sure why there is a difference in observation. Maybe subtle
differences in distro build. There is a build flag where you can set
tmpfs for /tmp on/off, and some reports of a bug where this flag gets
ignored (so /tmp becomes a directory).

//////////

Simon
Reinhard Kotucha
2018-04-09 19:23:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by Markus Kohm
Post by Simon Dales
Stretch uses tmpfs
$ cat /etc/os-release | grep PRETTY_NAME
PRETTY_NAME="Raspbian GNU/Linux 9 (stretch)"
$ mount | grep /tmp
$
Same on Jessie.

$ cat /etc/os-release | grep PRETTY_NAME
PRETTY_NAME="Raspbian GNU/Linux 8 (jessie)"
$ stat /tmp/ | grep ^Device
Device: b302h/45826d Inode: 2552 Links: 8
$ stat /usr/ | grep ^Device
Device: b302h/45826d Inode: 2559 Links: 12
Post by Markus Kohm
/tmp is even not a mountpoint but a directory of /.
Simon, what makes you think that /tmp is in tmpfs? What's the output
of df(1)?

Even if /tmp would be in tmpfs I won't worry either. I only ran out
of memory once when I compiled TeX Live with MAKEOPTS=-j4, which was
certainly a bit too optimistic.

As far as the limited amount of write operations is concerned, it's
more problematic that Chromium steadily creates files in $HOME even if
it's doing nothing useful. You'll notice it if you update your
backups with rsync and run rsync twice. I'm convinced that /home is
much more critical than /tmp.

Regards,
Reinhard
--
------------------------------------------------------------------
Reinhard Kotucha Phone: +49-511-3373112
Marschnerstr. 25
D-30167 Hannover mailto:***@web.de
------------------------------------------------------------------
Johannes Hielscher
2018-04-09 21:27:12 UTC
Permalink
Am Mon, 09 Apr 2018 10:27:44 +0100
Johannes,
Post by Johannes Hielscher
Addressing the patience with the bad I/O performance of mmcblk and
I would not hesitate to recommend just to take out the µSD, put it
into an ordinary PC, and ./install-tl the armhf-linux binary
distribution along with the native one there (you can delete it
from within your RPi if you don't need it any longer, e. g. to
compare the TeX performance of your SBC with dedicated PC
hardware).
Have you actually tested this route?
Even the other way round. I installed TL18 pretest on a µSD plugged
into a Toshiba AC100 (armv7h, 512MB RAM minus what the GUI needs; maybe
relieved by the magic little word "zram", that comes preconfigured with
the AC100 Unbuntu image, and is definitively worth to be considered for
any low-RAM&don't-wanna-swap-to-flash constellation for the Yodas
amongst us).
No hassle at all (besides the slowness of course), I installed for
the platforms {armhf,x86_64,aarch64}-linux, and also tested them by
carrying the card to my desktop PC, an AArch64 SBC, and another armv7h
notebook.

Those tests were not comprehensive, but the few binaries ran fine and
found anything needed from texmf on the µSD.

In a portability view, this is indistinguishable from a network install
on, say, an NFS share. That also has worked seamlessly since I can
remember setting up shared TL via tlmgr.
Clearly you have to be really concentrating when setting the paths in
tl-install/tlmgr. Else it stomps on your PC's own happy TeX Live
installation.
That is true, as it is for any ordinary, local installation.
But does it make the right soft links, ls-R files etc?
Should it?
Please correct me, but I never needed more than
export PATH="/media/sd/texlive/2018/bin/armhf-linux:$PATH"
and some patience on building formats when I ran the binaries for the
first time (and, in case of LuaTeX, a whole lot of extra patience for
the font database).
For other jobs I would agree.
Post by Johannes Hielscher
The bandwidth of carrying around mass storage devices is
unmatched.
Sneaker-net's king. An artic could grab big bandwidth if it rocked up
at CERN. Big latency on the M25.
//////////////////
Simon
Norbert Preining
2018-04-09 02:20:19 UTC
Permalink
Hi

(sorry for not answering on your earlier email, too busy)

You say that the installer does create a lot of *FILES* in /tmp, which I
disagree. It creates temporary directories ... which shouldn't take up
much space, actually minimal space.

I am surprised which files are created on the RPi...

Norbert

--
PREINING Norbert http://www.preining.info
Accelia Inc. + JAIST + TeX Live + Debian Developer
GPG: 0x860CDC13 fp: F7D8 A928 26E3 16A1 9FA0 ACF0 6CAC A448 860C DC13
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